Thank you Gina for your generous consideration of my view point.
I apparently hit on a very hot topic!
I appreciate the responses and views of you all - most of which I'd
considered in my thinking through this issue, some of which
I admit are new to me. The discussion here is just an indication of the
controversial nature of this subject. Hopefully we can learn from each
other (on this and other topics) as we all have different experiences and
perspectives to contribute.
From: Gina Bisco <[log in to unmask]>
To: [log in to unmask] <[log in to unmask]>
Date: Tuesday, July 11, 2000 7:05 AM
Subject: Re: intro and puppies
>Welcome to the list and thanks for a thoughtful statement of your ideas on
>subject of hip evaluation. It is a touchy subject of course, so I hope all
>will be able to keep our respectful stance toward one another even as we
>about our differences of opinion on this topic that is so close to many
>> My concern with OFA certification is that by using this as a bench
>> mark of sound dogs and culling those dogs that do not measure up
>> that we are losing genetic diversity and opening up the door to many
>> more problems and diseases within the different breeds.
>There is no doubt that this can be the case, if it is not deliberately
>with great care. There are many many traits to consider in breeding dogs
>one trait put way way ahead of others in selection surely could be
>to the gene pool no matter how very very important that one trait may be.
>I would say that for any breeder to use OFA or PennHIP or GDC hip
>evaluation/certification as a BENCHMARK or sole criterion of soundness is a
>mistake. Soundness is much more complex than radiographs can show.
>However, at this time radiographs are about the only way to see whether
>arthritic changes have already begun and before the onset of overt signs
>(clinical signs) of lameness or such. So radiographs, while not by any
>whole story on soundness, can give very important information that is
>to deciding whether an apparently sound dog is actually has begun to
>Of course, as you have mentioned the evaluation process is not without
>Sandra N. made the case very eloquently a while back that vets are perhaps
>generally not concerned enough about the potential effect of xrays on the
>and sperm. I know my own vets are not "breeder vets" and are therefore look
>my dogs with a somewhat different set of priorities than I do. Most of
>patients have been altered so consideration of the effects of
>treatment/evaluation procedures on reproduction doesn not come up that
>sometimes I have to remind them of special concerns. Given that most of
>xrays are done on an injured animal that NEEDS radiographs NOW, it may be
>perfectly understandable that no procedure for protecting the reproductive
>organs has been already established in their practice. But breeders can
>such protection for their dogs undergoing xrays, and surely vets should
>the request and have some method for doing so (as with humans, lead
>The anesthesia risk is also not to be poo-pooed. I know that our vets who
>animals under anesthesia every day may not always understand this concern.
>fortunate that at least one of the vets I work with is very concerned about
>anesthesia risks. I was personally opposed to the use of anesthesia for hip
>xrays for a long time but I now see that for some animals it might be
>psychologically rather traumatic to be physically restrained for xrays and
>may simply not hold still enough, and for some the positioning could cause
>physical pain. I am looking into going to Michigan State where they do
>of hip and elbow xrays with sedation and not anesthesia. A remaining
>whether the sedation is just as risky as full anesthesia... but no doubt it
>far less expensive. My own vets are currently pretty set about using
>for hip and elbow radiographs. The only reason I am able to take that risk
>my own dogs, is that it I would feel worse not knowing about their hip
>Naturally, given the apparent polygenic nature of the disorder, I know that
>dogs may still produce pups with hip dysplasia even if they are not
>will feel very badly if any of my puppies do turn out to have hip
>I would feel much worse if I didn't know the evaluations of their parents.
>give me the possibility of avoiding the situation of finding out after the
>that I'd bred together two parents who already had arthritis in their hips
>without clinical signs at the time of breeding.
>Even in a breed where there might be a small and closely related
>if it is considered by most conscientious breeders as necessary to breed
>dogs with hip dysplasia because otherwise the breed would go extinct (such
>think may be the case with St. Bernards and Neopolitan Mastiffs), it makes
>to take the precaution of not breeding two dogs together who both have
>Amy, I'm sure you've thought about all of this as you've given a considered
>statement of your position. As a caring person, I'm sure you have deeply
>about all this and clearly believe you are doing the best for your dogs. I
>hardly expect my own brief statement of my position to be sufficiently in
>to affect your thought process on this subject. However since my opinion
>differ from yours, I felt the need to register that with some small
>of my own.
>Very best wishes for your puppies: hoping they each get truly great homes
>have a long and wonderful life!
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