LISTSERV mailing list manager LISTSERV 16.5

Help for SCIENCE-FOR-THE-PEOPLE Archives


SCIENCE-FOR-THE-PEOPLE Archives

SCIENCE-FOR-THE-PEOPLE Archives


SCIENCE-FOR-THE-PEOPLE@LIST.UVM.EDU


View:

Message:

[

First

|

Previous

|

Next

|

Last

]

By Topic:

[

First

|

Previous

|

Next

|

Last

]

By Author:

[

First

|

Previous

|

Next

|

Last

]

Font:

Proportional Font

LISTSERV Archives

LISTSERV Archives

SCIENCE-FOR-THE-PEOPLE Home

SCIENCE-FOR-THE-PEOPLE Home

SCIENCE-FOR-THE-PEOPLE  July 2011

SCIENCE-FOR-THE-PEOPLE July 2011

Subject:

Re: Lynn Margulis, on 9/11

From:

Jim West <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

Science for the People Discussion List <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Sun, 3 Jul 2011 14:02:34 -0400

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (318 lines)

Michael Balter, 

It appears you are inverting reality.  Isn't it actually the government that is 
vague about those passenger lists?

Please substantiate your claim by providing the four passenger lists to which 
you refer.  

-Jim West
http://harpub.co.cc

==========
On Sat, 2 Jul 2011 07:24:16 +0200, Michael Balter 
<[log in to unmask]> wrote:

>9/11 conspiracy theorists continue to be very vague about who was in the 4
>airplanes and what happened to the passengers.
>
>This is sort of where I came in on this list more than 4 years ago. Mitchel
>was posting about 9/11 truth and HIV denialism, as were a few others. I
>thought we had moved on.
>
>MB
>
>On Sat, Jul 2, 2011 at 1:12 AM, Mitchel Cohen
><[log in to unmask]>wrote:
>
>>
>> http://rockcreekfreepress.tumblr.com/post/353434420/two-hit-three-down-
the-biggest-lie
>>
>> Two Hit, Three Down - The Biggest Lie
>>
>> National Academy of Science member and Distinguished Professor endorses
>> David Ray Griffin's work exposing the truth of 9/11
>>
>> By Lynn Margulis
>>
>> I comment here on the nanotechnology aspect of Jerry Mazza's masterful
>> review (Rock Creek Free Press, January 2010, page 6) of David Ray Griffin's
>> extraordinary 2009 book, The Mysterious Collapse of World Trade Center 7:
>> Why the Final Official Report about 9/11 is Unscientific and False.
>>
>> By the time we (Dorion Sagan -- my eldest son and Sciencewriters partner 
--
>> and I) met David Griffin [DRG] in 2003 in his native habitat at the Center
>> for Process Studies (which is on the campus of the Claremont School of
>> Theology in southern California), he had written over two dozen books, 
none
>> of which I had ever read or even heard of. We immensely enjoyed a three-
day
>> scientific-philosophical meeting on the Darwinian-evolutionary view of life
>> that had been organized by Griffin's sage mentor, the sweet-tempered but
>> razor sharp, Jimmy Carter-sounding, octogenarian professor emeritus and
>> director, John B. Cobb, Jr. The results of this fascinating meeting have
>> since been published (Cobb, ed. 2008).
>>
>> At that meeting, Griffin's talk was sober, academic, competent, scholarly
>> -- and entirely new to me: Christian theology in a much broader
>> philosophical context than any to which I had ever been exposed. The
>> science-friendly philosophical outlook Griffin espoused apparently was
>> developed by Alfred North Whitehead (1861-1947), the English
>> mathematician-philosopher who became a Harvard professor, or by Cobb. 
Why
>> would I have known anything about this theological-philosophical work? My
>> own expertise after all is in protoctist and organellar genetics. With close
>> colleagues I reconstruct the origin and evolution of nucleated cells in the
>> Proterozoic Eon. Where I understood DRG's talk at all, he made clear to me
>> his honesty. Truth, especially scientifically/empirically established truth,
>> seemed intrinsic to his Christianity. As a typical agnostic scientist
>> overtly critical of organized, and even disorganized, religion, I was
>> surprised by the scientific commitment to approaching empirical truth in a
>> religious context rather than the usual authority-pleasing consensus.
>>
>> Griffin went on to elaborate that, although as a Whiteheadian he embraces
>> the methods and results of science, he is critical of the entire
>> international scientific enterprise as generally practiced today. Not only
>> do scientists extrapolate their intrinsically specialized empirical
>> knowledge into intellectual territory where it does not belong, but they
>> don't heed Whitehead's recognition that, after all, scientists -- like all
>> people -- have an emotional life and an inner spirit. The acclaimed
>> "objectivity of science," on close scholarly inspection (by, say, Cobb,
>> Griffin and other Whiteheadians), often translates into tribalism, jingoism,
>> naivet�, denial of obvious truths, uncritical service to The State, and
>> other forms of profoundly dangerous ignorance. Scientists, as do all groups
>> of people, share unstated philosophical assumptions. For example, they not
>> only have faith in the consistency and "knowability" of the real world, but
>> they often assume that the concrete particulars of the world are 
adequately
>> described by the abstractions that have proved useful for limited purposes
>> in their own disciplines -- an assumption that Whitehead called the "fallacy
>> of misplaced concreteness."
>>
>> On the return trip east from this meeting, I read, non-stop, DRG's seminal
>> book on 9/11, The New Pearl Harbor. Since then I have watched the "aging
>> theologian" (his self-description as quipped in the excellent video-graphed
>> lecture "9/11 and Nationalist Faith" (or was it 9/11: Let's Get Empirical?
>> Both are highly recommended) metamorphose from a compelling, careful 
scholar
>> to a brave and extraordinary orator (but still careful scholar). Griffin has
>> become a superb politician with a single agenda item: We must re-open 
public
>> inquiry into the events of September 11, 2001, especially the collapse of
>> the World Trade Center.
>>
>> I had personal reasons to be interested in this issue: I had watched a
>> member of our Geosciences Department (University of Massachusetts-
Amherst)
>> realize that morning that his beloved brother was on the doomed Boston-to-
LA
>> "hijacked plane." Two of my sons and both of their mates were on 
Manhattan
>> Island on 9/11. My grandson, Tonio Sagan, the Problemaddicts hiphop 
lyricist
>> and leader, was released from his Springfield probationary status to me that
>> evening. Like everyone else close to the action, my global consciousness 
was
>> instantly and permanently altered on that date. But I happily remained an
>> academic evolutionist. So, I ask here, what happened to the "aging
>> theologian" to cause such a radical shift in his personal and professional
>> life: from ivory tower scholar expert in theology and philosophy to
>> detective, orator, and political activist?
>>
>> I will not try to answer this question, but will simply state: Griffin has
>> become a scientist, in my view, and even more a science educator. He has
>> undertaken the search for the solution to a relatively trivial scientific
>> problem and has found it in the literature and through discussions with
>> experts. Along with solving the scientific problem, however, he has 
burdened
>> his life with a colossal science-education problem.
>>
>> In spite of his authorship of eight excellent books on the subject, he is
>> not winning the education skirmish. This is not surprising, because science
>> education battles -- I can tell you this from chronic painful experience --
>> are far more intrinsically difficult to win than those of mere science. I
>> illustrate this point with regard to the destruction of the World Trade
>> Center.
>>
>> The scientific problem:
>>
>> Why did three World Trade Center buildings (#1,#2 and #7) collapse on 
9/11,
>> after two (and only two) of them were hit by "hijacked airplanes"?
>>
>> The scientific answer:
>>
>> Because all three buildings were destroyed by carefully planned,
>> orchestrated and executed controlled demolition. Ignited by incendiaries
>> (such as thermate) and high explosives (including nanothermite), the steel
>> columns were selectively melted in a brilliantly-timed controlled
>> demolition. Two 110-story buildings (towers 1&2), plus one 47-floor building
>> (WTC 7), were induced to collapse at gravitationally accelerated rates in an
>> operation planned and carried out by insiders. The apparent hijacking of
>> airliners and the crashing of them into the Twin Towers were intrinsic parts
>> of the operation, which together provided a basis for claiming that the
>> buildings were brought down by Muslim terrorists. The buildings' steel
>> columns, which would have provided irrefutable physical evidence of the use
>> of explosives, were quickly removed from the scene of the crime.
>>
>> Impeccable logic and addiction to reading inspire this truth-seeker. With
>> his practiced scientific mind (he has organized professional
>> philosophy-of-science conferences and published several books on this 
theme)
>> coupled with investigation of evidence from not only us scientists but from
>> witnesses, documentary film-makers, scholars, architects and engineers et
>> al., he concludes that the virtual free-fall collapse of the three (not two)
>> World Trade Center buildings in 2001 was a premeditated, exquisitely
>> executed operation. He recognized this "tragic publicity stunt" (my claim)
>> was likely intended to provide the "new Pearl Harbor" desired by radical
>> neoconservatives, some of whom had become members of the Bush 
administration
>> (see Ch. 6 of Griffin's 2006 book, Christian Faith and the Truth behind
>> 9/11).
>>
>> The far-more-difficult science-education problem:
>>
>> The persistent problem is how to wake up public awareness, especially in
>> the global scientifically literate public, of the overwhelming evidence that
>> the three buildings collapsed by controlled demolition. (Much has been
>> published in peer-reviewed scientific journals, see Ch. 4 of The Mysterious
>> Collapse). We, on the basis of hard evidence, must conclude that the
>> petroleum fires related to the aircraft crashes were irrelevant (except
>> perhaps as a cover story).We citizens of Earth within and beyond the
>> boundaries of the United States who demand detailed evidence for
>> extraordinary claims agree with Griffin: the rapid destruction of New York
>> skyscrapers on September 11, 2001 was planned and executed by people 
inside
>> the US government.
>>
>> Griffin's eight books about 9/11 (listed below) are his call to his kind of
>> truly patriotic action. They show in appropriate detail, accurately
>> documented, that the official government conspiracy theory can not be
>> correct journalistically, scientifically, and morally. Muslim airline
>> hijackers, in short, never triggered the collapse of high-rise steel-framed
>> buildings at gravitational acceleration into neat removable pieces. They
>> didn't remove the remaining steel girders before they could be studied as
>> evidence for a huge crime. They were not described in telephone calls by
>> passengers and crew members from the four airliners -- all the evidence for
>> al Qaeda hijackers on the planes dissipates under close inspection (for
>> example, even the FBI now admits that the reported cell phone calls from
>> 25,000 to 40,000 feet never happened).
>>
>> And to me the most compelling and obviously incorrect accusation is that
>> Muslim hijackers caused the pulverization of cement high-rise office
>> buildings into tons of dust that contain crystalline thermate and other
>> minute metallic particles not found in the usual charred remains of fire
>> rubble. Minute iron-aluminum-molybdenum rich spheres, steel perforated 
with
>> swiss-cheese type holes and large quantities of unreacted nanothermite are
>> not components of petroleum office fires. Besides the fact that building
>> fire temperatures, even if fed by jet-fuel, could not have risen beyond
>> 1,800�F, and hence they would be nowhere close to the of 2,800�F 
needed to
>> melt iron (or for molybdenum that melts at 4,753�F). The facile appeal to
>> the presence of gypsum (calcium sulfate) in the office wall-board fails to
>> explain why sulfur was found in the intergranular structure of pieces of
>> steel. (There was no detection of calcium!) The New York Times, in a rare
>> example of honest reporting about the WTC collapses, called this "the
>> deepest mystery uncovered in the investigation").
>>
>> Nor could "Muslim terrorists" have accessed and then planted in these
>> buildings huge quantities of nanothermite. This recently developed high
>> explosive was developed mainly in secrecy by professional scientists and
>> engineers who enjoy government grant support for "nanotechnology" by the
>> military. Significant quantities of red-gray crystals of nanothermite have
>> been found in several independently collected samples of WTC dust studied 
by
>> a team headed by physicist Steven Jones, formerly of Brigham Young
>> University. Niels Harrit, a University of Copenhagen professor of chemistry
>> who specializes in nanochemistry, is the first author of a peer-reviewed
>> paper reporting this team's results.
>>
>> The two mutually exclusive "9/11-conspiracy theories", the patently and
>> nefariously absurd tale our government imposes on us and the true, criminal
>> story yet to be entirely brought to light, deserve the attention of all
>> literate people. Remember: Only two airplanes struck, but three buildings
>> collapsed at free-fall velocities on that same day. Begin with Mazza's
>> review and Griffin's book that detail the nanothermite scientific studies.
>> Examine the government's reluctant late admission that WTC 7 came down 
in
>> absolute free fall for over two seconds to realize this is a scientific
>> impossibility unless all the steel columns were partitioned into neat,
>> removable pieces by explosives. Find out what happened to two men, Hess 
and
>> Jennings, trapped inside WT7 in its abortive explosion before noon. Truth
>> here, as David Ray Griffin tries to tell it, is (at least to me) stranger
>> and far more dramatic than even the best fiction.
>>
>> Suggested sources of evidence and explanation:
>> John B. Cobb, Jr. 2008 Back to Darwin: A richer account of evolution,
>> Erdmann Publishers
>> Michael Ruppert 2009 Collapse: Peak oil, global politics, depletion of
>> world resources and the end of "civilization" Chelsea Green Publishing Co.
>> White River Junction VT
>> Lecutre by D.R. Griffin and M. Ruppert on DVDs.
>> DRG:
>> 1. The New Pearl Harbor: Disturbing Questions about the Bush 
Administration
>> and 9/11 (2004)
>> 2. The 9/11 Commission Report: Omissions and Distortions (2005)
>> 3. Christian Faith and the Truth Behind 9/11: A Call to Reflection and
>> Action (2006)
>> 4. 9/11 and the American Empire: Intellectuals Speak Out (2006, co-edited
>> with Peter Dale Scott)
>> 5. Debunking 9/11 Debunking: An Answer to Popular Mechanics and Other
>> Defenders of the Official Conspiracy Theory (2007)
>> 6. 9/11 Contradictions: An Open Letter to Congress and the Press (2008)
>> 7. The New Pearl Harbor Revisited: 9/11, the Cover-Up, and the Expos�
>> (2008).
>> 8. The Mysterious Collapse of World Trade Center 7: Why the Final Official
>> Report about 9/11 Is Unscientific and False (2009)
>>
>> **********************************************
>> *Lynn Margulis is a professor of Biology in the GeoSciences Dept. at
>> UMASS-Amherst and author of numerous (and seminal) writings on 
Symbiosis,
>> EndoSymbiotic theory, and anti-neo-Darwinian evolution theory.
>>
>> *
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>  http://www.MitchelCohen.com
>>
>>
>>  <http://www.mitchelcohen.com/>Ring the bells that still can ring,  Forget
>> your perfect offering.
>> There is a crack, a crack in everything, That's how the light gets in.
>> ~ Leonard Cohen
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>-- 
>******************************************
>Michael Balter
>Contributing Correspondent, Science
>Adjunct Professor of Journalism,
>New York University
>
>Email:  [log in to unmask]
>Web:    michaelbalter.com
>NYU:    journalism.nyu.edu/faculty/michael-balter/
>******************************************
>
>�Faced with the choice between changing one�s mind and proving that 
there is
>no need to do so, almost everyone gets busy on the proof."
>                                                  --John Kenneth Galbraith
>

Top of Message | Previous Page | Permalink

Advanced Options


Options

Log In

Log In

Get Password

Get Password


Search Archives

Search Archives


Subscribe or Unsubscribe

Subscribe or Unsubscribe


Archives

May 2019
April 2019
March 2019
February 2019
January 2019
December 2018
November 2018
October 2018
September 2018
August 2018
July 2018
June 2018
May 2018
April 2018
March 2018
February 2018
January 2018
December 2017
November 2017
October 2017
September 2017
August 2017
July 2017
June 2017
May 2017
April 2017
March 2017
February 2017
January 2017
December 2016
November 2016
October 2016
September 2016
August 2016
July 2016
June 2016
May 2016
April 2016
March 2016
February 2016
January 2016
December 2015
November 2015
October 2015
September 2015
August 2015
July 2015
June 2015
May 2015
April 2015
March 2015
February 2015
January 2015
December 2014
November 2014
October 2014
September 2014
August 2014
July 2014
June 2014
May 2014
April 2014
March 2014
February 2014
January 2014
December 2013
November 2013
October 2013
September 2013
August 2013
July 2013
June 2013
May 2013
April 2013
March 2013
February 2013
January 2013
December 2012
November 2012
October 2012
September 2012
August 2012
July 2012
June 2012
May 2012
April 2012
March 2012
February 2012
January 2012
December 2011
November 2011
October 2011
September 2011
August 2011
July 2011
June 2011
May 2011
April 2011
March 2011
February 2011
January 2011
December 2010
November 2010
October 2010
September 2010
August 2010
July 2010
June 2010
May 2010
April 2010
March 2010
February 2010
January 2010
December 2009
November 2009
October 2009
September 2009
August 2009
July 2009
June 2009
May 2009
April 2009
March 2009
February 2009
January 2009
December 2008
November 2008
October 2008
September 2008
August 2008
July 2008
June 2008
May 2008
April 2008
March 2008
February 2008
January 2008
December 2007
November 2007
October 2007
September 2007
August 2007
July 2007
June 2007
May 2007
April 2007
March 2007
February 2007
January 2007
December 2006
November 2006
October 2006
September 2006
August 2006
July 2006
June 2006
May 2006
April 2006
March 2006
February 2006
January 2006
December 2005
November 2005
October 2005
September 2005
August 2005
July 2005
June 2005
May 2005
April 2005
March 2005
February 2005
January 2005
December 2004
November 2004
October 2004
September 2004
August 2004
July 2004
June 2004
May 2004
April 2004
March 2004
February 2004
January 2004
December 2003
November 2003
October 2003
September 2003
August 2003
July 2003
June 2003
May 2003
April 2003
March 2003
February 2003
January 2003
December 2002
November 2002
October 2002
September 2002
August 2002
July 2002
June 2002
May 2002
April 2002
March 2002
February 2002
January 2002
December 2001
November 2001
October 2001
September 2001
August 2001
May 2001
March 2001
February 2001
January 2001
December 2000
November 2000
October 2000
September 2000
August 2000
July 2000
May 2000
April 2000
March 2000
February 2000
January 2000
December 1999
November 1999
October 1999
September 1999
August 1999
July 1999
June 1999
May 1999
April 1999
March 1999
February 1999
January 1999
December 1998
November 1998
September 1998
August 1998
July 1998
June 1998
May 1998

ATOM RSS1 RSS2



LIST.UVM.EDU

CataList Email List Search Powered by the LISTSERV Email List Manager