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Thank you, Herb.  Rob Mann's repetitious, irrational hatred for half the
human species - the kind of pronounced and intentionally offensive hatred
that inflames, encourages, and abets actual physical assaults on women
worldwide - has been frequent on this list.  It most certainly makes every
other person on the list - every other man, to be blunt - look as though
they and the list *condone* and support such violence, in word, in thought,
and in deed.

I am not surprised that you speak out against this; I know you've done so
before. I appreciate that you and a few other men on the list explicitly
denounce such misogyny.  I've had to conclude that many other men on the
list covertly agree with Mann's prejudiced beliefs and disreputable tactics
for insinuating them into often-unrelated topics, because their tacit - and
at times explicit - tolerance of it shows their willingness to let them be
carried forward.

Socialism and this list have long been tainted by this kind of masculinist
bigotry and its willingness to let a few carry out campaigns of
offensiveness from which other men, and women who submit to them, then
quietly benefit without admitting the short and long term costs. The costs
to the list have included wider participation of women - a black eye for
this list and its stated goals - and a hostile atmosphere for those on it,
like myself, who are forced to filter out the vitriol and question the
motives of the many men who tolerate it.

As you say: Racism, misogyny and homophobia are contradictory to the stand
and tradition of Science for the People.

It's long since time that the SftP members admitted that misogyny is no more
welcome or helpful to progressive science than are calls for racism,
sterilizing the poor, killing homosexuals or the disabled, or any other
similar program of genocidal or ecocidal discourse, theory, and practice.

I strongly support the call for the list moderator, Michael G., to issue
such a warning against the posting of such misogyny.

Claudia

On Sun, Aug 24, 2008 at 12:23 PM, herb fox <[log in to unmask]>wrote:

> That Rob Mann is a misogynist is not news to those who have been reading
> his stuff off and on.  This serious flaw in his character and politics does
> not deny that he has also contributed well-informed critiques of GM and
> other stuff.  Racism, misogyny and homophobia are contradictory to the stand
> and tradition of Science for the People.  Since we (or rather Mike G) do not
> have the resources to examine his every contribution in order to filter out
> his destructive and insulting trash,  it would be appropriate to invite him
> to remain on the list only if he suppresses his in-your-face misogyny.
>
> Robert should examine how he himself does exactly the opposite of that for
> which he commends Kendall.  He has used unscientifically gathered
> correlations to determine cause.  That the growth of interstate highways and
> divorce examined as time series beginning in the 50s through the 70s show
> strong correlation is hardly the basis to conclude that highways cause
> divorce.  That there is a marked correlation between the misogynist trash
> appearing on this list serve and communications from New Zealand is hardly
> the basis for concluding that New Zealand scientists tend to be misogynists.
>  Calling attention to the necessity that critics of GM including SftP
> maintain high credibility by well founded and documented science is a
> positive contribution.  Maintaining our credibility as a progressive,
> critical voice based on sound science is indeed essential  For that reason
> we must deal firmly with insulting, unscientific misogyny.
>
> I recommend that one racist, misogynist or homophobic post earns a warning
> to the poster.  Repeated racist, misogynist or homophobic posts is an
> adequate basis to remove the poster from the list.
> herb
>