--Jerm wrote-- Well, maybe I should recant a bit. If it is really dumping they could turn you around at any one of these places if you don't have chains and you are in a 2wd (4wd in super extreme cases, but in that weather the ski areas will likely be closed anyway). In pretty much any of these cases a competent New England driver will be fine in any car. So my suggestion, if you want insurance against being stopped, is to craft a nice "AWD" decal to put on the back of your POS rental car and keep your momentum up. If your rental is a 4/AWD you definitely don't need chains. I never owned or needed them in 7 years there. --End of quote-- We ski in OR a couple of times a year (Hoodoo & Ashland). Our first stop, after picking up the rental car, is to buy chains at Wal-Mart that fit the vehicle. As long as you keep the receipt, and don't open the box, you can return them within 30 days. So, our last stop, on the way back to the airport, is to return the chains. You are right about not actually needing them. We just have to "carry" them. So far, we have only really needed them once, and the snow was so good we forgot about the expense. A couple of years ago, the PNW was totally closed to air traffic, and we had to drive from SF. When we got to Grants Pass, on I-5, the highway patrol was turning around anyone without 4WD or chains. Me: We are from New England, and know how to drive a FWD car in snow. Him: Sorry, but I cannot let you go unless you have chains, or you **tell** me <nudge, nudge, wink , wink> you have 4WD Me: Oh, did I say we had FWD? My mistake; **this** car has 4WD. Him: All right, then. You can go. And away we went. David P.S. Crystal rocks - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - SkiVt-L is brought to you by the University of Vermont. To unsubscribe, visit http://list.uvm.edu/archives/skivt-l.html