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So we've settled it at 3-1. A tablet, chromebook, laptop for each student.

We didn't discuss cell phone plans at schools for students yet ; )



On Mon, Dec 15, 2014 at 2:00 PM, Elizabeth McCarthy <
[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>
> ​Chromebooks and GAFE have evolved over the past year where most of the
> Google Apps will work offline as long as you sync. As far as video editing,
> WeVideo seems to be working on that end as well, ​they have a basic WeVideo
> Next Chrome web app which work offline. As I said it's their basic editor
> only (Storyboard)
> https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/wevideo-next/limlkeaboocfcfncjkkghclkjidbedem
>
> But I imagine they are working on getting their full editors to sync and
> work offline as well. I also wonder how often that need for offline access
> will remain given the fact that the majority of students/adults do have
> online access and that is something I would expect will improve in the
> coming year.
>
> *Elizabeth McCarthy, MAT*
> *Digital Learning SpecialistGoogle Education Trainer*
> Google+google.com/+ElizabethMcCarthy
> <https://www.google.com/+ElizabethMcCarthy>
>
>
> On Mon, Dec 15, 2014 at 1:31 PM, Jennifer Burton <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>>
>> One of my concerns in the Great Device Debate is usability offline. We
>> have a lot of students who do not have Internet access at home. While there
>> are alternatives to things like iMovie for the Chromebook that are
>> web-based, they aren't usable without access. For this reason we are shying
>> away from Chromebooks.
>>
>> On Mon, Dec 15, 2014 at 1:10 PM, Lucie deLaBruere <[log in to unmask]>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Steve's comment about "none of this" addresses students,  prompted me to
>>> chime in and ask a question  related to  student use.   How important is it
>>> if our 'less expensive" Chromebooks can do 80% of the work we want and not
>>> the 20% of our student outcomes that fall under the heading of Creativity?"
>>>
>>>
>>> To me this is huge!  And because I like to consider myself Cross
>>> Platform, I am always looking for solutions for the "school"  or "students"
>>> that have access to each platform.  I have a Mac, Chromebook, Windows
>>> machine, iPad and Android tablet within reach so I can keep trying
>>> different workflows based on what the students or teachers I am working
>>> with have available.
>>>
>>> When we look at a MacBook and Chromebook  are we comparing only the
>>> hardware? Does the comparison change a bit when we add some creativity
>>> tools to the Chromebook?  What are the creativity tools available for the
>>> Chromebook?  In order to try to answer that question  I have started this
>>> Google Presentation so we can crowdsource the answer to that.  Please add
>>> to it:
>>>
>>> https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1k5UPQ6aAiwIPNIRp8MDO7DtvPX7PIRuqcJVq7zBJNj8/edit#slide=id.p
>>>
>>>
>>>  We all know that Macbooks come with iMovie and other great time tested
>>>  creativity tools.
>>> When I give students a Chromebook, I would hope that I also provide that
>>> students with some creativity apps.  If we were to add some "Creativity
>>> tools"  like We Video EDU  to the Chromebook,  would it help bridge some of
>>> the gaps between the Chromebook and Macbook.
>>>
>>> I often hear teachers say that their schools will only consider FREE
>>> APPS. Are we willing to throw a few bucks into the pot to provide our
>>> Chromebook users with some Creativity tools and move 80% up to.... 90%?
>>>
>>>  For example, while We Video does offer a free version, the PRO version
>>> allows Green Screen and many other increased features.   I do not want to
>>> start a We Video vs. iMovie discussion (that's not the point).    I just
>>> want to see if we can add "not dismiss"  our Chromebook users as the ones
>>> who won't have access to Creativity tools and say we are willing to "give
>>> up" that functionality.
>>>
>>> Hope you'll add to the Slides here if you have some suggestions
>>>
>>>
>>> https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1k5UPQ6aAiwIPNIRp8MDO7DtvPX7PIRuqcJVq7zBJNj8/edit#slide=id.p
>>>
>>> Disclaimer about my use:
>>>
>>> When I taught in a school that had "no resources"  we learned all I
>>> could about Linux and open source software and had a dual boot machine.  I
>>> refused to use a Mac while I was there  and believed in  "eat your own
>>> dogfood"
>>>
>>> When I worked in a school that went iPad 1:1  I spent all my time
>>> looking for creativity tools so that the iPad use went beyond consumption.
>>>
>>> When I started to work with teachers who had Androids,  I started to
>>> look for solutions for those users.  There were few at the time, but
>>> developers are finally starting to port their apps to Android so that is
>>> improving.
>>>
>>> When I work with students and teachers who are Chromebook schools, I
>>> want to have workflows that will work for them on their Chromebook so I
>>> reach for my Chromebook.
>>>
>>> A few years ago, I MADE myself buy a Macbook so I could get better that
>>> supporting the students and teachers I worked with who had Macbooks.
>>> Forcing myself to use my Macbook was challenging at first, but NOW I love
>>> it.  (mostly because of the SOLID keyboard and display is easier on my
>>> aging eyes)  But most of my work is in the cloud,  so any machine with a
>>> good keyboard and display would probably meet that requirements here.
>>>
>>> I do have a 'couple'  uses that would not be able to be met with a
>>> Chromebook -- but don't require a MacBook, it just happens to be what I
>>> have now. These are
>>> Current work in the maker ed movement (ie. plugging in Arduino boards)
>>>  or my 3D printer software.
>>> Sometimes I need to export a HIGH RESOLUTION image and have not figured
>>> out how to get a 300 dpi image off a Chromebook.
>>>  Some Webinars using Blackboard Collaborate etc.
>>> and a few time when someone sends me an non compatible file that needs
>>> and lastly... I must admit that I LOVE Camtasia Studio, and even though
>>> I can do most Screencasting on Chromebook,  there are times I resort back
>>> to the high quality (and fairly expensive screencasting software for a
>>> slightly more polished look)
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Mon, Dec 15, 2014 at 11:02 AM, Matt Henchen <[log in to unmask]>
>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Thanks for your contributions Raymond and Steve.  I think everyone in
>>>> this thread has given schools a good amount of information to chew on.
>>>> Good stuff!
>>>>
>>>> Thanks again everybody.
>>>>
>>>> On Mon, Dec 15, 2014 at 10:27 AM, Steve Ligett <[log in to unmask]>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Matt - I haven't contributed to this discussion because I have little
>>>>> objective information to add. However, it sounds like you're also looking
>>>>> for subjective thoughts, so...
>>>>>
>>>>> I own an Acer C720 Chromebook and a MacBook Pro - I purchased both
>>>>> this year for my personal use. I've used Macs ever since Apple brought
>>>>> prototypes to Dartmouth in 1983, and I've used Chromebooks for a couple of
>>>>> years. I prefer the larger and better ("retina") screen of my MacBook Pro,
>>>>> but if the Chromebook is closer, I'll generally just reach for that when I
>>>>> have something to do. Most of what I do is Internet-based now - I have
>>>>> Microsoft Office on my Mac, but I don't use it to create new documents, I
>>>>> use Google. I am an Apple fan, and my music and photo libraries keep me
>>>>> tied to the Mac. I expect the MacBook to last 6 years, and the Chromebook
>>>>> to last 3 years (the MacBook cost over 6 times as much as the Chromebook) .
>>>>> For student use, I would be more tempted to purchase a case for the
>>>>> Chromebook than for a MacBook, as the Chromebooks I've used are not as
>>>>> sturdy as a MacBook.
>>>>>
>>>>> I think the Mac is more elegant, but the value of the Chromebook
>>>>> undeniable. Chromebooks do not have the polish of the Mac - *I think*
>>>>> that Google is firmly in the "good enough" world - they won't expend the
>>>>> (probably double) effort for elegance. Development (software changes) occur
>>>>> at a rapid pace on the Chromebook. (That may be good or not.)
>>>>>
>>>>> When I travel, I carry the Chromebook. If it is lost, broken, or
>>>>> stolen, a) I'm not out much money, and b) there's no data lost. The
>>>>> Chromebook also came with 12 free "Gogo in-flight Internet" passes so while
>>>>> I'm flying, I can use the Chromebook - including printing (to a printer at
>>>>> my house, or my brother's, or at the schools I work in).
>>>>>
>>>>> I love the simplicity of managing Chromebooks - I say that the hardest
>>>>> part of managing one is sticking the asset tag on it (then you're done). I
>>>>> use a Ubuntu print server (at school and at home) that supports Macs,
>>>>> Windows, Linux, Chrome, and iOS clients. It works well for all of them, but
>>>>> one day Google broke our Chrome printing, and it took me a bit to figure
>>>>> that out (I had to re-share the printers). We have about 120 Chromebooks at
>>>>> WRVS and we'll buy more next year - we may be at 1-to-1 without  having an
>>>>> explicit "1-to-1 program".
>>>>>
>>>>> None of the above directly addresses teaching students (I don't teach
>>>>> in a classroom). I love bits and bytes but Chromebooks are part of the new
>>>>> appliance/black box world. I hope we continue to show kids how to "get
>>>>> their hands dirty" with programming and "making".
>>>>>
>>>>> steve
>>>>>
>>>>> On Fri, Dec 12, 2014 at 4:05 PM, Matt Henchen <[log in to unmask]>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Thanks Larry.  Have you ever owned a Macbook Air?  In fact, is there
>>>>>> anybody on this ListServ that has used both a Chromebook and a Macbook Air
>>>>>> for an extended period of time?  I'm obviously biased toward a Mac, since
>>>>>> that is what I use (although I was a lifetime PC user before coming to my
>>>>>> current school).  I am also biased toward Mac because I would love my
>>>>>> students to be able to do serious video editing - which is much more
>>>>>> difficult on a Chromebook.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I really do appreciate everybody's opinions.  It's been a fascinating
>>>>>> discussion.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Fri, Dec 12, 2014 at 3:47 PM, Larry Dougher <[log in to unmask]>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Matt,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> We purchased the ASUS C200 this summer for three schools for $243
>>>>>>> each.  The model the previous school year was the Samsung 303 (brand new at
>>>>>>> the time) for $249.  We haven't paid more than $269 since the pilot year.
>>>>>>> That being said, I budgeted $349 each because there is no telling what will
>>>>>>> be out in the summer when we build the budget in the fall (4GB, 802.11ac,
>>>>>>> etc.).
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Again, I have used a Chromebook exclusively for almost three years
>>>>>>> and a Chromebox since the summer and it's weird but I never felt like I had
>>>>>>> a less functional device.  Again, though I'm not a "kid".
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> *Larry Dougher*
>>>>>>> Chief Information Officer
>>>>>>> Information Technology Services <http://its.wsesu.net>
>>>>>>> Windsor Southeast Supervisory Union <http://wsesu.net>
>>>>>>> 127 State Street, Windsor, VT 05089
>>>>>>> Email <[log in to unmask]> | Google+ <http://goo.gl/gEAdt> | Twitter
>>>>>>> <http://twitter.com/larrydougher> | LinkedIn
>>>>>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/larrydougher> | (802) 674-8336
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Fri, Dec 12, 2014 at 3:36 PM, Matt Henchen <[log in to unmask]>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> With all due respect Bjorn - your comparison of a $250 Chromebook
>>>>>>>> to a $1200 Macbook is highly misleading.  The best price for a Chromebook
>>>>>>>> right now is around $269 (per Peter Drescher) and the current price for a
>>>>>>>> Macbook Air is $849.  Plus Apple will be signing a contract with the state
>>>>>>>> and will more than likely offer a better price than that.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Fri, Dec 12, 2014 at 11:56 AM, Bjorn Behrendt <[log in to unmask]>
>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I have always been about accessibility.   I personally hate it
>>>>>>>>> when k-12 schools teach expensive applications, without also showcasing the
>>>>>>>>> free low-cost alternatives.   They may not have as many features, but at
>>>>>>>>> least once the class is over (or the student graduates) the student still
>>>>>>>>> has access to the tools they learned about in school.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> The worst thing we can do for our students it to have them think
>>>>>>>>> they can only write a document in MS. Word or edit a photo in Photoshop.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Handing them a Mac or Windows Laptop with all the bells and
>>>>>>>>> whistles, may work well for them while they have access to the resource,
>>>>>>>>> but take that away and they are left thinking that to do the same things
>>>>>>>>> they need to spend thousands of dollars.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> My personal vote is for accessibility over features.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> As for durability, if a student is going to drop their backpack
>>>>>>>>> down some steps, or trip while it is raining and have the device fall in
>>>>>>>>> the water I would rather it be a $250 device than a $1200 one.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> *Bjorn Behrendt M.Ed ~ Never Stop Learning*
>>>>>>>>> *   [log in to unmask] <[log in to unmask]> | (802) 772-0003
>>>>>>>>> <%28802%29%20772-0003>*
>>>>>>>>> *   Google Apps For Education Certified Trainer & Administrator*
>>>>>>>>> *My Sites*
>>>>>>>>>  ~ Edlisten.com ~ Educational Podcast
>>>>>>>>>  ~ AskBj.net ~ Online Training and Ed Tech Resources
>>>>>>>>>  ~ VTed.org ~ Vermont's Personal Learning Network
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> gClassFolders
>>>>>>>>> <https://sites.google.com/a/askbj.net/edlisten-resources/my-resources/gclassfolders>~
>>>>>>>>> Create Google folders for your class.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On Fri, Dec 12, 2014 at 11:34 AM, Adam Provost <[log in to unmask]
>>>>>>>>> > wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> 90%... I'd like to enter that debate to see if that number rings
>>>>>>>>>> true. I think it's overstated.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> On Fri, Dec 12, 2014 at 11:33 AM, Adam Provost <
>>>>>>>>>> [log in to unmask]> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Hardware durability is crucial. So is usability.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Personally, I much prefer a fully functional laptop for kids
>>>>>>>>>>> within and outside school... that is functional creatively. Schools that
>>>>>>>>>>> encourage that creative use outside school walls go much further. I've seen
>>>>>>>>>>> and visited schools who so severely 'institutionalize' a powerful laptop
>>>>>>>>>>> that it is basically unintuitive, and only functional as a basic app and
>>>>>>>>>>> web research tool. The school philosophy around the usage of the device is
>>>>>>>>>>> paramount.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> On Fri, Dec 12, 2014 at 11:21 AM, Matt Henchen <
>>>>>>>>>>> [log in to unmask]> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Agreed.  And I would argue that too often the discussion is
>>>>>>>>>>>> about "what we do at school" as if that is the only place students develop
>>>>>>>>>>>> skills and knowledge. So I supposed the discussion is what is that thing,
>>>>>>>>>>>> that device, that ALL students will have access to.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> On Fri, Dec 12, 2014 at 11:15 AM, Joanne Finnegan <
>>>>>>>>>>>> [log in to unmask]> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Too often the discussion is around devices, not learning. I
>>>>>>>>>>>>> still advocate that there is a need for a variety of devices for students
>>>>>>>>>>>>> whether the environment is 1:1 or not. For example, an elementary school
>>>>>>>>>>>>> with only Chromebooks is doing a disservice to kids if there are no tablets
>>>>>>>>>>>>> available for creating movies, using whiteboard apps for explaining
>>>>>>>>>>>>> concepts, etc. Yes, you can do all that with a Chromebook, but it takes
>>>>>>>>>>>>> much more time away from the actual learning (i.e., content) to do what is
>>>>>>>>>>>>> simple and fast on a mobile device/iPad/tablet.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Joanne
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Fri, Dec 12, 2014 at 11:03 AM, Raymond Ballou <
>>>>>>>>>>>>> [log in to unmask]> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mike
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Brendan beat me to the car analogy, so I will just add.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> There is a lot of 'what business uses' or 'most popular this
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> or that' postulation in Ed Tech.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> If that applied in the Driver Ed world, our 'car' would be a
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Ford F150.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> For 1-1, expectations benefit from being device agnostic, as
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> none of us know how things will unfold ...
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I echo what others have said re:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> CART                        =>  HORSE
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> what do we want to do => what are our device options
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> R
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I don’t think you can fairly compare the most expensive
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> solution to the least expensive solution.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Search <http://list.uvm.edu/archives/school-it.html> the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> SCHOOL-IT Archive
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Joanne Finnegan
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Semi-retired Technology Integrationist
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Former math and computer programming teacher
>>>>>>>>>>>>> 42 years in education and still love to learn!
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> -----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Search <http://list.uvm.edu/archives/school-it.html> the
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>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>>> Matt Henchen
>>>>>>>>>>>> Civics Educator
>>>>>>>>>>>> Harwood Union High School
>>>>>>>>>>>> History Blog - http://newschoolhistory.com/
>>>>>>>>>>>> <http://newschoolhistory.com/>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Professional Blog - http://www.vermonteducator.com/
>>>>>>>>>>>> <http://www.vermonteducator.com/>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Twitter - @MattHenchen
>>>>>>>>>>>> Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/newschoolhistory
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> -----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Search <http://list.uvm.edu/archives/school-it.html> the
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>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>> Adam A. Provost, MAT
>>>>>>>>>>> Technology Integration - Partnership for Change Initiative
>>>>>>>>>>> <http://partnershipvt.org>
>>>>>>>>>>> Burlington High School, Vermont <http://bhs.bsdvt.org/>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Personal Blog: creativeStir.blogspot.com
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>> Adam A. Provost, MAT
>>>>>>>>>> Technology Integration - Partnership for Change Initiative
>>>>>>>>>> <http://partnershipvt.org>
>>>>>>>>>> Burlington High School, Vermont <http://bhs.bsdvt.org/>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Personal Blog: creativeStir.blogspot.com
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> -----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Search <http://list.uvm.edu/archives/school-it.html> the
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>>>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>>>> Search <http://list.uvm.edu/archives/school-it.html> the
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>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>> Matt Henchen
>>>>>>>> Civics Educator
>>>>>>>> Harwood Union High School
>>>>>>>> History Blog - http://newschoolhistory.com/
>>>>>>>> <http://newschoolhistory.com/>
>>>>>>>> Professional Blog - http://www.vermonteducator.com/
>>>>>>>> <http://www.vermonteducator.com/>
>>>>>>>> Twitter - @MattHenchen
>>>>>>>> Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/newschoolhistory
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Matt Henchen
>>>>>> Civics Educator
>>>>>> Harwood Union High School
>>>>>> History Blog - http://newschoolhistory.com/
>>>>>> <http://newschoolhistory.com/>
>>>>>> Professional Blog - http://www.vermonteducator.com/
>>>>>> <http://www.vermonteducator.com/>
>>>>>> Twitter - @MattHenchen
>>>>>> Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/newschoolhistory
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
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>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Matt Henchen
>>>> Civics Educator
>>>> Harwood Union High School
>>>> History Blog - http://newschoolhistory.com/
>>>> <http://newschoolhistory.com/>
>>>> Professional Blog - http://www.vermonteducator.com/
>>>> <http://www.vermonteducator.com/>
>>>> Twitter - @MattHenchen
>>>> Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/newschoolhistory
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>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Lucie deLaBruere
>>> www.LearningWithLucie.com
>>> http://twitter.com/techsavvygirl
>>>
>>> Google Voice (802) 557 0013
>>>
>>> [log in to unmask]
>>>
>>> --------------------------------------
>>> Nothing is really work unless you would rather be doing something else.
>>>   - James M. Barrie
>>> ---------------------------------------
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>>
>>
>> --
>> Jennifer Burton
>> Library Media & Technology--Lakeview
>> Technology Integration--Hazen
>>
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-- 
Adam A. Provost, MAT
Technology Integration - Partnership for Change Initiative
<http://partnershipvt.org>
Burlington High School, Vermont <http://bhs.bsdvt.org/>

Personal Blog: creativeStir.blogspot.com